Phil is having a good amount of trouble over a couple of negative statements made by egalitarians regarding subordination in the trinity.
He writes, “I’m baffled when I read egalitarians who think that functional hierarchy presupposes disunity or the prospect of it.”
He sees three possible explanations:
- These men genuinely cannot comprehend how functional hierarchy can exist without sin.
- These men have intentionally used fallacious argumentation to defeat their opponents.
- These men have unintentionally conflated unrelated ideas in their zeal to disprove what they consider erroneous.
I think I might have an explanation for the origins of this words. Its just a guess, but hey, I’m trying.
Its related to Genesis. Many (though I’m sure not all) egalitarians do not accept the arguments for hierarchy existing before the fall. Rather they consider hierarchy as being a result from the fall. If this is true of Gilbert Bilezikian & Kevin Giles, then the connect between the Fall and hierarchy might be the catalyst that threw them over the edge.
Again, just a guess.
25 February, 2008 at 10:15 pm
Thanks for the thoughts, Mike. A quick response: clearly some hierarchy existed prior to the fall. God had authority over His creatures. Humans had authority over animals. And apparently some angels had a higher rank or status than other angels. Perhaps there were other examples of hierarchy (e.g., trinitarian and man–woman), but without question some hierarchy existed—and it existed without the slightest bit of disunity or conflict. And that’s my point: hierarchy and perfect unity are entirely compatible for sinless beings. Thus, functional hierarchy could exist in the ontological Trinity without in any way calling into question their perfect unity.
25 February, 2008 at 10:17 pm
[...] Mike mentioned my post at his blog. I responded with a comment. NotesKevin Giles, Jesus and the Father (Grand [...]
25 February, 2008 at 10:31 pm
Hi Phil,
Agreed, there was hierarchy before the fall. I was just trying to make a suggestion. My guess is that the answer for your question about which option it is is a combination of your #3 and perhaps a myopic and narrow perspective on hierarchy viewed only through the fall.